Nobody’s Coming to Save You—So Save Yourself with Self-Care

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Listeners, I am so grateful that you're here today.

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This is a special saddle up live.

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I had judge and, um, litigator from Texas,

Michelle Locke on doing divorce different,

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and she, I just, we had the greatest chat.

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I love talking to her and she

is, she does speak on the subject

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of self-care and I thought, what

a better place to talk about.

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Self-care that settle up live.

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So we did record a podcast

episode and it's so good.

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She's got tips that are gonna help you.

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Her story is, is tough, but it's

a good story to hear because it's

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uplifting, um, for all of us, us g.

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So stay tuned.

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You're gonna love her.

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I'm so glad you're here.

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Okay.

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Speaker: Okay, so now I've kinda

set the stage for this beautiful

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woman sitting in front of me, this

woman who wants to educate people.

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I love that about you, Michelle,

but I think what my listeners love

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to hear, they love to really get

to know the people on this podcast.

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Could you just share, I don't think

you've had an easy life or an easy story.

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can you share your authentic story so we

can get to know you a little bit better?

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Speaker 2: First off, I don't

like to think of my back.

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Ground is anything more

difficult than anyone else has.

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It's just my personal experience.

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Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

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Speaker 2: That being said, I'll

never forget, I was in second grade

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in Miss Henry's class and it was

October and my mom pulled us aside

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on a Friday after school and said

Dad wasn't coming back anymore.

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I remember my mom crying afterwards and I

remember myself crying, but I also don't

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remember it being some big surprise.

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leading up to that, my parents

had a tumultuous relationship.

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It was a hundred percent my dad's fault.

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I remember my dad slamming my mom up

against the wall, her begging him not

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to leave because the, I guess the flavor

of the week for him was sitting in a

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car across the street, to pick him up.

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I remember lots of times

with my mom crying.

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And I also remember about the same

time that she told us she was getting

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divorced or the dad wasn't coming

home anymore, that, she took me by

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the chin and she had me look up in

her eyes and she said, Michelle, she's

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like, you get an education and you

never depend on a man for anything.

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And that's because the position that

my dad put her in was not a good one.

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And that's because he was

a doctor and she wasn't.

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And FYI, for those that think that you,

you're a doctor's kid, so you grow up,

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privileged to have some great life.

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I can tell you that is a

hundred percent not accurate.

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In my case, it was quite the contrary.

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so been pretty independent minded and.

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driven as long as I can remember.

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And I remember going back and

forth between my dad's house, my

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mom's house, remember hating it.

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I remember coming home and my dad's

house smelled so bad because he

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had over 200 birds in his house.

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And y'all, I'm not talking

like canaries, okay?

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I'm talking like full blown, like Mulan,

Scarlets blue and grays, African grays.

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I mean, every kind of bird that.

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Was possible my father had.

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And so like my mom would make my brother

and I trip down to our underwear as

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soon as we got home on Sundays and

go shower because we smelled so bad.

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I say that because I saw and lived how

horrible divorce done wrong can be, and

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it wasn't done wrong because of my mom.

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it was truly done wrong because

I don't think my dad really.

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Gave a shit, for lack of a better

word, of the effect on the children.

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I think he really believed that you all

are kids and deal with it, suck it up.

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And that really was kind of his attitude.

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And so I remember when I was about eight

or nine years old, he told me that if I

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ever became a lawyer, he would disown me.

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And I was like, done.

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And so really, I don't think I've

ever deviated from that point forward.

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of wanting to be anything

else other than a lawyer.

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and so I went to undergrad, but got

my degree in finance because I didn't

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wanna be unemployed with a history major

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Speaker 3: mm-hmm.

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Speaker 2: In case law

school didn't work out.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 2: And then I still went to law

school and then graduated from law school

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at 25 The traditional like big law firm

route because I think that's what I'd

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always imagined I would do is go work

in Dallas or Houston for a big law firm.

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And I worked for the big law firm

for a while out in West Texas

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and realize how miserable I was.

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But I wanted to be in a courtroom

doing my passion, which at the time

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was criminal defense and family law.

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I mean, I did my first.

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Contested custody case.

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in law school, my third year of law

school and at the time I had met my,

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at the time husband we're now since

divorced, but he had two little girls

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and he had been a prosecutor for I

think 10 plus years at that point.

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And his girls were three and five.

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And I remember I wasn't gonna make.

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Because I met him when I was in law

school, wasn't gonna make two little

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girls lose their dad, because I think

he probably would've moved anywhere I

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wanted to go when I graduated law school,

but I wasn't gonna do that to two little

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girls because I knew how much I wanted

a dad in my life and my dad just wasn't.

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And so I made the commitment to stay

there until they graduated high school.

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the youngest graduated.

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In 2015.

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And so in 2016, I left,

moved to central Texas.

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I left a full-time judgeship.

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I was an associate, judge in

family law in West Texas, and

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I've done it for about five years.

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but from practicing law now for 23,

I came back to Central Texas where I

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went to undergrad and really started

over again with a practice and was

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able, fortunately, to make something

of myself pretty quickly, and I was

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able to gain a judgeship back here

within three years of me moving here.

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Speaker 3: Crazy for

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Speaker 2: one of the smaller

municipalities that are outside of Austin.

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And so that's kind of where I sit today.

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I am divorced.

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I've got three boys.

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I've got my dog and two cats.

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And my boys are 21 and he's a paramedic.

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The 19-year-old is still

in college, thank goodness.

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And then the 9-year-old is nine,

so he's still perfect 'cause

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the hormones haven't hit yet.

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I figured I got two, three more

years left before he turns into a

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teenage boy, which for about zero fun.

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I mean, I've been the stepmom.

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I do divorce law.

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I've been the kid of divorce.

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I've sat on the bench seeing divorces

from the judge perspective, and then

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I'm back in private practice and

now I'm divorced and navigating, how

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divorce works, from my perspective.

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And so I really have seen all sides of it.

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And so I don't know if that's a good

thing, bad thing or indifferent, but

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it gives me a pretty unique perspective

that I carry into my practice today.

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Speaker: Yeah, and I,

you know what I mean?

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I read up on you, I stalked you a little

bit, but I didn't know all of this.

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I didn't know all these details.

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And Michelle, I can't imagine if I were in

Texas, I can't imagine anyone that I would

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have different than you to represent me.

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Thank you.

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Because yeah, no, you have.

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Seen it from all sides and I just, I do

have to, I just have to call out that I,

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I feel so proud of how you took something

in your life that was kind of hard.

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You know, you went through hard things

as a kid, and look at how it has led

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your whole life and think of all the

lives you have touched and made better.

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Because of that.

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And so, oh, I'm just like,

you are my kind of people.

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I love that.

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And I'm so thankful.

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So thankful that you're

here sharing this story

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I mean, you are a busy gal.

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You've had a lot going on in your life.

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I wanna talk to you about self-care today

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Speaker 2: and

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Speaker: Yeah.

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and when I here,

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Speaker 2: I'm two weeks outta surgery, so

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I can absolutely talk about more than

probably ad nauseum, quite frankly.

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Speaker: Well, and you

know, I think the thing.

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Sometimes I have to get hit

over the head to actually start

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really taking care of myself.

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And I, and I had that happen, you know, in

the last year where things really change.

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But right now I'm sitting in, my

daughter is finishing up her residency.

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She's downstairs.

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sleeping.

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Well, yeah, she's sleeping.

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'cause she's working nights.

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She's got little Oliver, who's, I'm

running back and forth to daycare because

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hubby, they're, they're moving back by

us, which is so awesome when she's done.

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But hubby already got his

job, so she's here all alone.

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I'm like, what the hell is

she doing for self-care?

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Nothing.

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I mean, she's like, no, I assure you she's

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Speaker 2: doing nothing.

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Speaker: Nothing.

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I mean, she might jump on the Peloton,

but I don't think that's outta self-care.

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I think

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Speaker 2: that is not what

she probably needs right now.

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Speaker: no, no.

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I'm gonna share this with

her when she, has a moment to

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listen, but not just with her.

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I also for a period of time, was

a stay at home mom, you know,

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before I worked as an attorney.

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And by golly, that is

not easy stuff to do.

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I think that was when I did

not take care of myself.

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Probably that was the hardest time

for me because I felt like I had

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to let blood because, oh, I'm home.

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I have to do everything.

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I, you know, I can't complain.

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I don't have time for myself.

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and I loved how, something that I saw

that you had talked about self-care being

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as simple as getting your mammogram.

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and I just had my colonoscopy,

but you gotta know, honey, I don't

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know if you know this about me.

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They caught stage one breast

cancer on me a year ago.

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So I have been through, I mean, I

knew it was all gonna end up okay.

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I didn't right at the

beginning, but I went through

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surgery, chemo, and radiation.

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and I'm the lucky one.

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Right?

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Speaker 2: You are the lucky one.

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Speaker: Yeah.

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And at that moment I went,

holy shit, I need to rest.

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I need to rest more.

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And that's when a light bulb went on

that we need, joy and fun and rest.

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leading into that, I wanna hear

from you and learn from you.

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I want my daughter, those high

achievers, those stay at home moms.

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to learn how they take care of themselves.

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Speaker 2: So, funny you

mentioned the breast cancer story.

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My journey, and I don't think many

people know this, my very first mammogram

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when you turned 40 Found a lump.

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and I was told that it was, because

they do the B rrAD rating of, tumors for

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breast cancer and before actual diagnosis.

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And they had rated mine like a B rrAD

four, which is basically it's cancer.

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But they haven't gotten the

confirmation from the biopsy.

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B five is it's, they know it's

cancer, but it's not been confirmed.

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if I recall the B rrAD scales correctly,

and they rated mine at the B rrAD

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four because it was, they had, it

was veins going to it and everything.

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And my gynecologist said, here's,

I'm gonna send you up to the, one

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of the best breast cancer surgeons

in Austin set up the appointment.

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And so I had a 2-year-old at the time.

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I was like, and 40 my

very first mammogram.

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Fortunately it came out to be

benign, but I still had the lump.

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I had a lumpectomy to have it

removed because it had, where we

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found out it had abnormal cells so

it would've turned it into cancer.

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And so I go back to telling

everyone that's where I self-care

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is really as simple as a mammogram.

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Because in mine I don't have the genes.

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Like I did all the genetic

testing me, so me neither.

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So I don't have the genetics

for the pancreatic cancer or

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the ovaries or the breasts.

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But guess what?

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I still had a lump and it was my 40th.

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I went and they found something

and it was terrifying.

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Speaker 3: But that

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Speaker 2: To figure out that I really

needed to care for myself, and that's

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when I woke up in October of 2020.

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So during Covid, I woke

up and I couldn't move.

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It was a Saturday morning and I had

some, like, neck problems and stuff in my

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shoulders and my neck, but I dealt with

that for five years and I just attributed

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it to, I sit in an office, I sit in a

chair all day long and it's stressed.

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I have a very, I'm a litigator.

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I go to jury trials.

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'cause Texas is the only state left the

judge jury trials for family law cases.

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so I just figured it was stress.

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My hands were going numb when I slept.

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I figured it was stress and I ignored

it until I couldn't wake up and so, or

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I couldn't move when I woke up, and so

I sat in like a hot tub bath for two

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hours that morning and barely helped.

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I was like, well, lemme go get a massage.

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Lemme go see my chiropractor.

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None of that worked.

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Then a week later I went to my orthopedic

surgery group 'cause they by now

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treated my spine, my knees, my ankle.

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And I got in and they did this.

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Here's a steroid pack for five days.

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If that doesn't work, call us back.

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And called back, said,

send me for their MRI.

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And I went back for the MRI and I was

in, I was in surgery 10 days later.

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My doctor told me I was

risking permanent paralysis.

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and had my first cervical

fusion in November of: 2020

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Then I had my second cervical fusion

in November of: 2022

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third cervical fusion two weeks ago.

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And so, it's been, and that's

just the tip of the iceberg.

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I was also, for a period of time,

probably around 300 pounds, I

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don't really know how heavy I got

because I stopped weighing myself.

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I think the highest I ever weighed myself

was like 2 94, 2 96, and I just stopped.

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I've now lost 110 pounds.

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You look amazing.

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You're beautiful.

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Well, thank you.

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but it's been a journey to

get here and I wish that I had

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not put everyone else first.

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I put my step kids first.

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I put my kids first.

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I put my husband first.

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I put everyone first because

that's how I was raised is

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that's what wives and moms do.

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Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

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Speaker 2: And I did it to my detriment.

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And what I tell now, 'cause this

is really one of the platforms I

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speak on, on the most, is no one

will be there to care for your kids

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the way you care for them, period.

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And so if you don't take care of yourself

and you don't get, you know, the early

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screening exams and you don't do what

you're supposed to do, then you're

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not gonna be around for your kids.

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And that's kind of really what shook me.

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And that's probably the reason, that's

one of the reasons why I'm divorced, is

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because we had won too many arguments and

it was detrimentally affecting my health.

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I mean, I, my blood pressure was so

high in December of 20, 22, 23, 20

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23 that I think I almost stroked out.

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I, then had to go for iron

infusions 'cause my eye was anemic.

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it was just my body was a wreck

and my marriage was miserable.

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he was probably as miserable as I was.

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And then we just had, we had a fight in,

I think March of: 2024

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I was killing myself because I

thought staying for the benefit of the

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kids was what I was supposed to do.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And it just, it was

not, and it's not advice that I

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would tell anyone now to follow.

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I think my advice now is get out

when you can and get out early.

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Because it's only worse the kid

and it's not any good for the kids.

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And when you're older and get, when

you're older and get divorced, when the

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kids are older, the kids more take sides.

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And not only do the kids take

sides, but it's harder on the kids.

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They don't wanna have to adjust

and the parent loses out.

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And then the damage that

occurs to those kids.

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Seeing parents argue, seeing their parents

in an unhappy marriage, everyone thinks,

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oh, well it's better to stay together.

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And I gotta tell you, I think I'm

of a different belief now from

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what, 'cause I thank God every

day that my parents got divorced.

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Thank God.

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Every day.

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thank God they got divorced.

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Thank God.

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I don't think I'd be the person I

am today without my stepdad, who,

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has been wonderful, wonderful to

me, wonderful my brother, lifesaver,

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quite frankly in so many ways.

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And I am where I am today solely, well,

not solely, my mom's a rockstar, but

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between the two of them most instrumental

people for why I am where I'm in my life.

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: 00:16:03

Speaker: Well, and I think that is a.

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: 00:16:05

I think that's a message.

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: 00:16:06

Sorry I didn't interrupt.

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: 00:16:07

No, I interrupted you.

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: 00:16:08

I didn't mean to, it's

hard on these calls.

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: 00:16:11

We don't mean to, we're polite people.

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: 00:16:14

Yeah, but I mean, I think the

message is to make this less scary

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: 00:16:18

for some women out there is I.

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: 00:16:22

This might actually be the

best thing for your kids.

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: 00:16:24

And I am like a proponent

of marriage, Michelle.

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: 00:16:27

I have been married for 34 years.

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: 00:16:30

Oh.

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: 00:16:30

My husband's gonna kill me.

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: 00:16:31

I can't remember if it's 33 or 34.

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: 00:16:32

So I've been married a long time.

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: 00:16:34

I'm a grandma.

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: 00:16:35

Like now I do strength training so

I can lift grand babies, you know?

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: 00:16:39

I have a son who does

everything for everyone too.

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: 00:16:42

Like why is it that we

put other people's needs?

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: 00:16:46

Because if we're not here, like

you said, then God can't use us.

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: 00:16:51

We can't parent our children.

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: 00:16:52

So tell me, give me a little bit.

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: 00:16:55

Give the listeners a little bit of

a few tips, just a few tips on how

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: 00:16:59

they can take care of themselves.

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: 00:17:01

How can they change that so that they're

thinking of themselves and seeing that

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: 00:17:05

is what's really gonna help their kids?

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: 00:17:07

Speaker 2: Well, number one, it's

not selfish to think of yourself.

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: 00:17:12

I mean, that's really number one.

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: 00:17:13

it's not selfish.

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: 00:17:15

it's, that's what you're supposed to do.

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: 00:17:16

I have some people that I know

now, some other women professionals

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: 00:17:20

like me that'll take a week.

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: 00:17:22

Schedule instead of like going on

vacation, they schedule all their

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: 00:17:25

doctor's appoints in that week.

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: 00:17:27

I think that's actually pretty damn smart.

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: 00:17:29

I mean, I really do.

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: 00:17:30

I mean, just get it, get it all

out of the way and get it done.

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: 00:17:32

That way you can just carry

on with everything else.

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: 00:17:34

But number one is, taking care

of yourself is not selfish.

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: 00:17:38

That really is number one.

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: 00:17:40

The number two, I think most

useful thing is learning the word

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: 00:17:44

no and being okay with using it.

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: 00:17:49

It is okay to say, no,

I don't want to do that.

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: 00:17:52

I love telling doctors no,

because they're like, wait, what?

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: 00:17:56

And I have told doctors no quite often.

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: 00:17:59

but no, is your friend not an enemy?

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: 00:18:03

And people pleasing only

makes you miserable.

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: 00:18:08

Not everyone in life is gonna like you.

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: 00:18:09

And in fact, you're gonna have people,

some people that don't like you, I have

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: 00:18:12

a long list of haters and that's okay.

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: 00:18:15

And it's usually the people that

I've cross examined, they don't

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: 00:18:18

like me, I cross examine them.

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: 00:18:21

and it's okay.

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: 00:18:22

It's okay to have people not like you.

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: 00:18:24

You don't need your circle

of friends to be huge because

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: 00:18:28

you don't take them with you.

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: 00:18:29

What you leave behind is the

memories that your children have,

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: 00:18:33

that your grandchildren have.

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: 00:18:35

That's what's important, and so

that's why taking care of yourself

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: 00:18:39

is not selfish, because you'll be

around to help make those memories

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: 00:18:43

for those children and grandchildren.

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: 00:18:46

Speaker: Mm-hmm.

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: 00:18:46

Speaker 2: I thought those are the three.

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: 00:18:48

Speaker: Yeah.

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: 00:18:48

Love it.

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: 00:18:48

Speaker 2: Learn how to say no.

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: 00:18:50

Speaker: And I'm not good at, no.

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: 00:18:51

Especially with my children.

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: 00:18:53

Speaker 2: yeah.

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: 00:18:53

Of course not.

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: 00:18:54

They're grown.

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: 00:18:54

But I want people, please.

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: 00:18:56

I mean, you don't wanna disappoint anyone

and learning your boundaries and learning

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: 00:19:00

to say no has really been kind of.

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: 00:19:03

The last few years for me,

I'm not doing that anymore.

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: 00:19:06

I'm not people pleasing because it got me,

it, when you don't take care of yourself

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: 00:19:12

and don't find happiness in what you're

doing, but are doing it for everyone else.

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: 00:19:16

That's when depression kicks in.

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: 00:19:17

That's where you find other substitutes

that immediate, like, feel better kick.

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: 00:19:22

that's where I turned to food.

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: 00:19:24

I don't have any doubt that food

was an emotional support for me.

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: 00:19:26

Speaker: Right.

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: 00:19:27

Speaker 2: but Now it's

not even an issue anymore.

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: 00:19:29

But before it was that it really

was because I was miserable because

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: 00:19:32

instead of taking care of what I

needed to fill my cup, I was making

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: 00:19:37

sure everyone else's was full.

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: 00:19:39

Yep.

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: 00:19:40

I was making sure my husband had those

surprise birthday parties and the big

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: 00:19:44

mo moments and you know, many surprise

birthday parties he threw for me.

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: 00:19:48

Right.

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: 00:19:50

And think about it.

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: 00:19:50

Think about the people in your life and

how are they are adding to your plate.

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: 00:19:55

Helping share that plate.

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: 00:19:56

For example, how often are

you the one scheduling all the

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: 00:20:00

appointments for your spouse?

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: 00:20:01

How many times are you helping

do X, Y, and Z for someone, but

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: 00:20:04

they're not doing something for you?

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: 00:20:06

If someone is adding to your plate

continuously, but not helping

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: 00:20:10

share on that plate or that burden,

then how are they benefiting you?

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: 00:20:15

Speaker: Right.

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: 00:20:16

Well, and I think once you start

to realize this, you realize

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: 00:20:20

you are responsible for feeling

happy because you are the one

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: 00:20:25

and you set up those boundaries.

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: 00:20:27

it really has changed my life.

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: 00:20:28

In fact, I have a really dear

friend and she kind of forgot like

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: 00:20:32

a date I had to go in for that first

diagnostic mammogram and she just

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: 00:20:36

blew it off and I said, I need you.

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: 00:20:39

I need you to care because we're friends.

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: 00:20:41

It was okay.

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: 00:20:42

Right?

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: 00:20:42

And the old Lisa would've never done that.

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: 00:20:45

She would've stuck it.

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: 00:20:46

Right?

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: 00:20:47

She would've not respected how

I, I felt, I would've thought,

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: 00:20:50

well, I shouldn't feel that way.

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: 00:20:51

That's asking for too much.

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: 00:20:52

Well, what the heck if I need it from

my friend, I need it from my friend.

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: 00:20:55

So I love that.

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: 00:20:56

And I love everything you're

saying about self care.

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: 00:20:59

And that is, my wish is that this

can just be a starting block for some

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: 00:21:04

of those women out there to just.

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: 00:21:07

Have a better life and just

start taking care of themselves.

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: 00:21:10

Rest, you know, get your care.

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: 00:21:13

It's not something to feel guilty about.

435

: 00:21:14

It's, it's so that you can do

your work and your calling and,

436

: 00:21:20

and you know, whatever that is.

437

: 00:21:21

So, I love that so much.

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: 00:21:24

Speaker 2: it is hard for us to,

women embrace, especially moms

439

: 00:21:27

because we give, give, give, and give.

440

: 00:21:29

But I gotta tell you, and this is

kinda the journey that I've been on,

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: 00:21:33

is happiness, is you are 100% correct.

442

: 00:21:36

It is your own duty to

find your own happiness.

443

: 00:21:40

No one's gonna give it to you.

444

: 00:21:42

No one's gonna make you happy.

445

: 00:21:44

And if you're depending on those things

for happiness, you'll never be happy.

446

: 00:21:47

Right.

447

: 00:21:48

Like, it's not the cars, it's

not the David your room jewelry,

448

: 00:21:52

which is my happy place.

449

: 00:21:53

but it's, those things don't,

it's, it's an immediate, it's an

450

: 00:21:56

immediate high, but at the end of

the day when you're laying in bed,

451

: 00:22:00

that's not what's making you happy.

452

: 00:22:03

Speaker: Right.

453

: 00:22:03

And that's such a great point.

454

: 00:22:05

It's a great place to pause and end.

455

: 00:22:07

And thank you for being here.

456

: 00:22:09

Thank you for having me.