Episode 22

full
Published on:

15th Oct 2024

Breaking Barriers and Building Wealth

In this episode, the Lesa Koski welcomes Ed Vargo, co-founder and president of Burning River Advisory Group, to discuss financial empowerment for women. Highlighting Ed's personal journey, where his Korean immigrant mother faced financial struggles after a divorce, Ed shares his passion for helping women through financial coaching and wealth management. The conversation explores why discussing money can be challenging for women and offers insights into raising financially educated children. Covering topics such as loss aversion, the importance of financial literacy, and encouraging open discussions about money within families, this episode is a resourceful guide for women aiming to gain financial independence and knowledge. The episode also touches on Ed's initiatives, including Enlighten Her, designed to assist women in financial matters, especially during life transitions like divorce.

00:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome

00:49 Ed Vargo's Background and Mission

04:22 Personal Story: Ed's Mother and Financial Struggles

11:49 Challenges Women Face with Finances

18:32 Raising Financially Educated Kids

32:37 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

saddleuplive.com 

saddleuppod.com.  

@saddleuplive

https://linktr.ee/LesaKoski

Ed Vargo is the Co-Founder and CEO of Burning River Advisory Group and EnlightenHer, a community focused on financial mentorship for women. With over 20 years in financial services, Ed helps women navigate long-term financial planning for all life stages, including retirement, college, and transitions related to divorce or death. His dedication is personal; inspired by his mother’s financial struggles after his parents' divorce, Ed is committed to empowering women to confidently manage their finances and avoid similar hardships. He is a member of the Financial Planning Association® and the Society of Financial Service Professionals. Ed is married with five daughters, ages 18-24, whom he has raised to be financially empowered young women! 


Transcript
Lesa Koski:

Welcome listeners.

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I am extremely excited

to have you here today.

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And I have somebody that I've just

met and I told his name is Ed Vargo.

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He is the co founder and president

of Burning River Advisory Group.

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And I'm going to be honest, Ed,

when I was like, I was working.

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So here's the deal.

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I didn't tell Ed I'm sitting here in

a flannel shirt and my baseball cap.

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Because my listeners know I'm trying

to grandma more and work less.

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So I had a little workout class.

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I got to go clean a

horse stall after this.

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So I'm like, well, I can either

skip the workout class or, you

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know, I'll make myself look good or

I'm going to show up in flannels.

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And so I'm sure Ed got on this

column was like, who is this woman?

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But I promise we'll be a

little bit professional.

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But the reason I'm excited to have Ed

here is we're going to talk about things,

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but I feel like Ed has a little bit of

a twist, um, because he is devoted to

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helping women and he's going to share his

authentic story as to why, but I thought

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this is going to be a great conversation

for both my doing divorce different

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podcast and my saddle up live podcast.

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So usually I do two different

interviews, but I'm not doing that today.

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This is going to air on both podcasts

and we're going to talk about, um,

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why it's so difficult to talk about

money with our spouses or otherwise.

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And how can we remove the emotional

responses and add, I jump in because I

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have emotional responses to money and

I think I got a little better about it.

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So I'm going to.

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I want to talk to you about that.

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And then he's going to give us some quick

little tips and tools about finances.

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And finally, what we're all interested

in, whether we're getting divorced or

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we're at this stage of our lives is

how to raise financially educated kids.

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And I've got two that are fully grown.

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I think I did okay.

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That baby one, that's.

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Pulling up the rear who's out in college.

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I don't know if I did as good with her.

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So, Ed, I think you're going to

be a wealth of information, but

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I'm excited to have you here.

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I'm excited to get to know you better.

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And I really know that the listeners are

going to be really interested to hear your

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story as to what led you to help women.

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Deal with finances.

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Welcome.

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Oh, I have to say one other

thing that excited me.

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He's got five girls He's

a dad of five girls.

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So you gotta love a guy like that.

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So ad welcome.

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Thanks for being here

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Well, thank you.

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Lisa.

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I appreciate you having me on I think

that's what most people when they

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hear my story or the start of my story

It's like you have five daughters.

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I mean, is that for real?

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And they're really the love of my life.

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I mean, they're all older now They're

between the ages of 19 and 25.

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So i'm they're not old but They'll kind of

step some are stepping into adulthood and

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kind of finding their way on their own.

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And of course, some are

still tethered to the nest.

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But my story as far as why I've focused

my attention and my businesses, I actually

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have two businesses, burning river

advisory group, as you mentioned, that

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you're a traditional wealth management

business, kind of what you would think for

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most financial advisors with the twist.

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And that we are unique and we predominate

work with women led households, either

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single women or women led households.

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And in our industry, that is very

much the exception and not the rule.

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So there's a story behind that.

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And it dovetails into a new

company that we've started

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called enlighten her, which is.

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Also a financial company, but

more financial coaching versus

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traditional financial advice.

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So it's taken the learnings that I've

garnered over the past almost 25 years

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in personal finance and bringing it to

the masses, so to speak, because as a

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financial advisor, we can only work with

a relatively small number of people.

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People, but with enlighten her, we're

going to be able to reach out on a much

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broader scale and help those, whether

you're a multimillionaire or just starting

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out, we can find a way to help women.

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And that's really where my story starts

when it comes to working with women.

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So I think of it like the

tale of two cities, right?

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So I have my daughters today and

much of what I do revolves around

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helping them, putting them in the best

possible position to go out into the

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world, be good humans, do good things.

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And we're trying to do our part.

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My wife and I, in terms of raising.

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Um, good humans, right?

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Just good people.

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And my story originally though,

it starts with my mother.

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And so my mom is an

immigrant from South Korea.

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My father and her met

during the Vietnam war.

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He was stationed in Korea.

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They met there, got married.

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And a little bit of the American dream

at the start of this relationship

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came back to the United States and

proceeded to have four children.

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But it didn't quite go so well.

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So the relationship soured and they

ended up getting a divorce and that's

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the, the other side of this tale of two

cities, because my mom, unfortunately,

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because of, for many reasons, one, a

language barrier, cultural barrier,

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an economic barrier, she was not able

to maintain custody of us children.

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So it was an anomaly in the sense that, I

mean, divorce wasn't quite so common back

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then and my father ended up raising us.

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And my mom really didn't have, uh, she

didn't have any options quite frankly.

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And that's where I look at this.

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And I think of that as

a travesty, like my mom.

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I had to give up her four children

because she felt that she couldn't

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raise them because she didn't

have the financial means to do so.

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And so as I pivot, you know, I

carry that with me throughout.

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I didn't realize how much of

an impact it would have on my

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life as I got further into it.

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But I've carried that forward into a

lot of the divorce work that we do.

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Because we see a lot of women who come

into our, we're obviously a business

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that focuses on women who are going

through a difficult time like divorce.

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And I just never want to see a woman,

really anyone, but a woman in this case,

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have to face what my mom faced, having to

make real life decisions about what to do.

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Whether they have their kids

with them or not, because in this

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case of a financial issue, so,

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Lesa Koski: Okay.

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So see, I knew that I would love

talking to you and I love it

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when people go through something

difficult and then they help others.

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You're honoring your mom.

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You know, by doing this work and on this

show, I often, I'm getting teary eyed, but

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I, I do often, um, really want to comfort

women so that they know if you're a stay

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at home mom and haven't been working for

a while, I don't want them to be afraid

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if they're, Facing divorce and it's so

it's interesting because what I've said

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in the past is there are things that can

help you like spousal maintenance and But

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then I think of your poor mom years ago,

and I am hoping that that story would be

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different today For your mom that if she

were in that predicament today Well for

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one she could go to someone like you for

some support, but I would hope that You

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The legal system would support that more.

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Are you finding that?

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I actually have no idea because

this is kind of a new topic.

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I just thought, Oh no,

you're going to be safe.

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You're going to get spousal maintenance

for at least a period of time until

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you can afford to do this on your own.

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Your mom didn't have that.

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And she, I can't imagine

how that was for her.

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I, you know, you know how much

you love your children and then

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to be alone in this country.

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I mean, did she lose

all connection with you?

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Was she able to still connect

with you or how did that all work?

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Yeah, it was difficult on her of course,

and difficult on this as kids, because I

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mean, I might've, I don't really exactly

know how old I was and that may sound

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strange, but just how these things happen

and how life unfolds, it doesn't happen

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like in very definitive terms, right?

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So there was a separation.

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where we just thought she was staying

at a friend's for a long time and that

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became a finalized divorce and that

happened over a number of years so

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it's it was tough on us because we were

told one thing right and i'm sure our

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parents were trying to protect us and

my mom is very traditional You know, the

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Korean culture is very different than

the culture here in the United States.

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And that was part of the barriers

to her, her willingness or her

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understanding of what her options were.

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So, you know, my mom, um, in her

mind was like, she felt like,

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well, I can't take care of them.

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I would be doing them a disservice

by trying to have them at home.

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You know, I would be harming them.

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by keeping them, right?

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You can, you can understand

a mom thinking like that.

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And it was tough on us too, because

again, we really didn't know, you

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know, exactly what was going on.

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So to answer your question about how it

unfolded, there was a bit of a time where

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I don't think we were estranged, but

where we didn't have a lot of contact.

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There's four kids, you know,

so each of us took a different

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amount of time to reconnect.

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And that was born out of our own

understanding of the experience

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and how we felt and now I'll

won't go through all the details.

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It just took me longer to get over it.

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I'll say that.

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And eventually we did.

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And then we mended and

things are great now.

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Um, we have a great relationship.

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But, uh, it was a very difficult

time going through that.

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And so, today, could that happen?

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I would say yes.

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I would say yes.

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Yeah, it's possible because what

they're in the divorce arena, there

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isn't somebody looking out for you.

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There's no one coming and guiding

you and taking you by the hand and

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saying, Hey, here's how this works.

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Now we have the internet, you have

Google, we have a lot of, we're

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more socially connected, right?

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So we can go out and

find more information.

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But if somebody was faced with a similar

situation, a language barrier, my mother

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couldn't read the language, couldn't write

the language, had never, has never driven

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a car, um, since she was facing a lot.

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And so, yes, that could happen today.

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I think it's, it's

certainly far less likely.

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There are far more resources

available and socially there

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are more resources available.

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So I think that that exact

scenario happening in that way is.

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far less likely.

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That said, there's still a major barrier

when it comes to the understanding

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of how the divorce process works.

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And there is a lot of misinformation

or a misunderstanding.

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And again, there is no entity that's

going to come in and save the day.

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The court system's not going

to come in and say, Oh no,

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you're getting an unfair deal.

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Right.

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That's not really how it works.

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Right.

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And so, you know, one of my key messages

in working with women, whether you're

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going through divorce, just starting

out as one of my girls might be stepping

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into the professional workforce or

anywhere, anywhere in between is you

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really have to advocate for yourself.

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You can't be passive.

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You can't expect others

to do or take care of you.

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And I've worked in my relationship

with my wife at the fairly

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traditional household right now.

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My wife doesn't work outside the home.

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She was a NICU nurse for a long time.

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Right.

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Right.

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Right.

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You know, five kids in six

and a half years, you know,

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enough to take care of at home.

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So she was certainly working in the home.

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But it's really important for whether

you're in that situation or you're on the

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front lines in the primary breadwinner,

you really do have to advocate for

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yourself and start to get educated

about how the financial world works.

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You don't have to be a whiz, you

don't have to know the ins and outs,

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you don't have to be great at math.

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You know, there's a lot of things,

a lot of thoughts that sort

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of self limiting beliefs that.

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You know women have when it comes to

money that holds them back And some some

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guys, you know, a lot of men don't have

those same self limiting beliefs whether

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they're competent or not They're just

some things that um the way men think

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about money allow them to step Forward

where a lot of women are just standing on

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the sidelines or even stepping backward.

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Lesa Koski: Yep Okay, so that

kind of brings us to the first

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question Why, why is that?

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Why is it difficult for

women to talk about money?

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Like it is, it's getting better.

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I've been married almost 33

years and it's finally starting

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to get a little bit better.

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And I'm going to go a little bit

deeper as we keep going, but why is

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it so hard for women to talk about?

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You know that I don't think

there's a one right answer to that.

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It's a multitude of things.

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Certainly there is a.

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Sort of just how you were raised kind

of idea right now that is changing

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slowly, but surely, but it doesn't,

and it doesn't account for everything,

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but we learned from our parents, right?

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And so if you're not having

conversations at home around money.

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It's very much unlikely that your

children are going to start to have

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those conversations and particularly

for girls or for women and men tend

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to talk about morning that more more

about money naturally than women do.

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And so some of the studies out there have

shown that in general, this is a broad,

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you know, painting with broad strokes.

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So just take that into account.

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Men have a tendency to be to gravitate

towards things and women have a tendency

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to gravitate towards relationships.

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there's a lot of male engineers

and there's a lot of female nurses.

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And so that natural tendency

and money is a thing.

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So talking to my girls, talking to

my wife, talking to other females

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and women clients, they don't

gravitate toward the money as much

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as their male counterparts do.

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So.

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Yeah, I think it's an interesting,

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Lesa Koski: it's interesting because

I just had a little light bulb moment.

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I was going to ask you a question

about this, but it is so true what

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you just said, because I think

about my childhood and I know

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that my father did his very best.

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He really wanted us to

understand finances.

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And sometimes I almost think

it's harder when we were.

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Fairly well off, not super well,

you know, just kind of, but never

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was a hard, you know, money wasn't

hard to come by where my husband's

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family, it was harder to come by.

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And he learned about finances naturally.

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Like, you know, I've got to work for this.

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I don't want my dad to spend the money

that he needs for groceries for this,

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where I knew that my dad was saying,

you need to pay for your own college.

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Um, because he wanted me to understand.

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And when I was, I think I was 12

years old, my dad had this plan.

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I don't know where he learned it,

but it was, he was going to give

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us a, a certain amount of money.

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My brother who was two years

older and myself, and it

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was a pretty good allowance.

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And then we were to go and take

care of everything that we needed.

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So at 12 years old, I would buy

whatever I needed for like school

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clothes and, and I had a, an allowance,

but like if I ran out of money, I

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couldn't go to a movie with friends.

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Right.

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I mean, that was how he was.

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So my brother was.

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He was so excited about it.

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Didn't think twice.

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And I was like, I don't

want to do that, you know?

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And I never said anything because I was

very obedient and I would never have

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said that to my dad, which probably is

an issue too, because if I could have

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just told him how I felt, but it scared

me and I think it actually made me.

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Look away from it.

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And like I survived, I paid for college.

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I lived off a bag of potatoes.

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I'd rather buy an outfit than food.

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You know, I mean, I just, I figured

it out, but I never really healed

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that, the way that I felt about it

emotionally, where I like wanted

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to run away from it a little bit.

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And here you have the daughter and

the son both reacting completely

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differently to the exact same situation.

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Right.

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It is interesting, right?

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So there are some societal things

and I think there's some nature

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and nurture things and there again,

there's been plenty of studies in the,

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in the world of behavioral finance.

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I won't step too much into this space

because it's a, it's a big subject,

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but it talks about like, why do.

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The premises is like why do smart,

let's say intelligent, educated,

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affluent people make the same mistakes

as those who are less affluent,

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less intelligent or less educated.

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You would think that the

fourth first group would make

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patently better decisions.

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And what they found behaviorally is that

we're all kind of subjected to these

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behavioral or cognitive biases, which

gets into the male female sort of dynamic.

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So as an example, there is a

concept called loss aversion.

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And it's just how.

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Much do you fear losing?

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Right?

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So all of us, male and female are

hardwired where losses affect us to

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a greater degree than gains, right?

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That's why when the let's say that when

you lose money, it feels much worse

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than if you were gained the same amount.

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So I'll give an example.

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Let's say that I said, Hey, I want

to bet 100 heads or tails heads.

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You went 100 bucks tails.

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I went 100 bucks.

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And what happens is in order for somebody,

the average person to take that bet.

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I would have to pay them 200 if

they won, and they would only

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have to pay me 100 if they lost.

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Gotcha.

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So, we feel, even though it's the same

odds, and we have the exact same odds,

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50 50, but I have to compensate you

to two times the degree to get you

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to take that bet, and that's because

we're fear of, we're more fearful of

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losing money than we are gaining it.

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And that psychological trait carries

forward in women more so than men.

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Women are typically more

loss averse than men are.

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And so that's not just when it comes to

money, it's kind of a personality trait.

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And so we see this manifest itself in

the financial realm in a number of ways.

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It could be men are more willing

to take risk in the stock market.

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Then women are, we find

that to be the case.

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We find that men are more willing

to say, Oh, I'll apply for that job.

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Or I'll put my head through my head

in the ring for that job promotion.

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Even though they may not be ready for it.

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Whereas a woman might look

at that and say, well, I'm

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not quite ready for that yet.

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I don't want to do that.

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I want to just wait until I get ready.

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And then the guy's kind of throwing, you

know, caution to the wind and saying,

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Hey, I'm throwing my hat in the ring.

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And sometimes they get that job, you know?

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So there is some of that.

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Built into our sort of the fabric of

who we are And if we understand that we

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can work to overcome those barriers and

there's plenty of you know Cognitive

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biases that affect males in a way.

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That's not so positive Um, the key is

really just to understand what those

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are And so when I look at my girls

when i'm trying to do and raising

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them and instilling The proper money

mindset and I I don't think he asked

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me this question, but i'll since

i'm going down this path Yeah, yeah.

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Lesa Koski: Yeah,

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i'll just walk down it You But I think

a lot of women, mothers, want to know,

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well, how do we raise smart kids?

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Like, I think, what I find with

a lot of, say, women in their 40s

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and 50s, or even 30s, 40s, and 50s.

359

:

But if you're a little bit older, 14, 15,

certainly into your 60s, you look back

360

:

on your life and you're saying, gosh, if

I only knew then what I knew now about

361

:

money, I would do things differently.

362

:

And the whole, the company, Enlightener,

the whole idea, the genesis behind

363

:

that idea came from that thought.

364

:

How do we have the

greatest impact on women?

365

:

For future generations and we need

to get to them earlier in life if I

366

:

can get my girls to understand money

At least the fund the foundation.

367

:

They don't have to be a whiz at it

Just the foundation the fundamentals

368

:

of money start to make good decisions

at 18 19 22 24 And not make the big

369

:

mistakes that a lot of us have made

learn the hard way That's going to

370

:

put them on solid foundation, right?

371

:

They're going to be able to move forward

and then they're going to be able to

372

:

because women are very social You And so

they can start and we have to foster this.

373

:

I think this is definitely a part of

that barrier that you talked about.

374

:

Um, and it's not talking about money.

375

:

We need to foster this idea that

it's okay to talk about money.

376

:

It shouldn't be taboo.

377

:

It should be just like anything else.

378

:

In fact, money is one of the

most important resources.

379

:

I think it's the most valuable

personal resource that you own,

380

:

that you have access to, because

it touches everything in your life.

381

:

It doesn't mean you have to have

a lot of money, but you have to

382

:

be smart and do good with it.

383

:

And the better you are dealing with your

money, it has a multiplicative effect

384

:

on your life and it can enhance all

kinds of things in good and bad ways.

385

:

Lesa Koski: And I have to say

another light bulb moment.

386

:

This is very healing for me.

387

:

So as you're talking and remember,

I was telling you my dad, he

388

:

treated us both the same, right?

389

:

Myself and my brother.

390

:

I think it did have.

391

:

Some positive effects.

392

:

Like I said, how I was, didn't want

to do it and I was afraid of it.

393

:

But as you were talking about

the gains and the losses.

394

:

I am a person who is more

like a man where I go for it.

395

:

I take the risk.

396

:

Very, and I thought, well, that's

interesting because that might be

397

:

a gift from my parents for how,

you know, for them starting me so

398

:

young and understanding what it

really was, what it really meant.

399

:

But, you know, understanding

that, well, if I spent it on

400

:

this, I couldn't buy this.

401

:

And maybe going through college

and living off potatoes to have

402

:

nice clothes was the way to do it.

403

:

I don't know, but it worked.

404

:

And so that was, that's interesting to me.

405

:

So as we talk about, and we're kind of

jumping into how to raise financially

406

:

educated kids and you were saying,

you know, to make sure that especially

407

:

your girls are comfortable with it.

408

:

Are there any other things that

my listeners would want to.

409

:

to hear that could help with their

kids, even if they're young or if

410

:

they're like had enough to college.

411

:

Yeah, absolutely.

412

:

I think, first of all, I think it's,

it's totally okay to talk about money.

413

:

That's the first thing, right?

414

:

Money sometimes, Gets associated

in a negative light, right?

415

:

Like we assign negative characteristics

to money, but that's really unfair.

416

:

Money is, um, neutral and so you

can use money and your relationship

417

:

with money could be very negative

or it could be very positive.

418

:

So I think of money as a relationship.

419

:

I think we need to

nurture that relationship.

420

:

We need to cultivate it

and we need to share it.

421

:

And so the first thing would be is,

okay, it's okay to talk about money.

422

:

Now, you don't have to talk about

everything and you don't have to

423

:

talk about things that are, if

you find personally uncomfortable.

424

:

So as an example, what I don't tell

my girls is like how much money

425

:

we make as a household, right?

426

:

I don't get into those types of

details, but we talk about money all

427

:

the time, but not in a way that you

might think of financial advisor might.

428

:

So I am not out there having a lecture.

429

:

I don't have a whiteboard going

through different financial concepts.

430

:

That's never happened, but we

might, I think one of the biggest

431

:

things you can do is again, and

by having your conversations.

432

:

In front of them modeling good behavior.

433

:

So let's just say even if your

financial situation's a mess, right?

434

:

Well, let's be honest Some of us have

a bad situation and some are very

435

:

good and we're everywhere in between

that aside We still want to model

436

:

good behavior for our kids, right?

437

:

Even if we're a mess We still want to

hold it together present the right front

438

:

to them And I think modeling that good

behavior is very important And one of

439

:

the ways you do that is you you have

to give them You Agency over money.

440

:

You don't learn how to deal with money

until they have money in their hands

441

:

because the thing about and I'm not

going to get to an economics lessons,

442

:

but there's this idea of scarcity.

443

:

And so if you had a limited supply

of money, you wouldn't learn any

444

:

money lessons because you could

just spend it on anything you wanted

445

:

and just more money would show up.

446

:

That's why so many of those who

are very wealthy are out of touch

447

:

because most of us just can't do that.

448

:

They haven't learned

the concept of scarcity.

449

:

It's hard to teach

scarcity without living it.

450

:

Right.

451

:

You lived there, r You said you

struggled a what this is like.

452

:

That w up an inner city neighbor and

my father's single ho steelworker.

453

:

We had basic I won't get into that

whol I know what scarcity is like, and

454

:

fortunately, my girls, I mean, we haven't

always been as fortunate as we are now,

455

:

and because we had them over a certain

period of time, they've experienced

456

:

different levels of scarcity, but what

I've always done is put some money in

457

:

their hands and then coach them on it.

458

:

And at the youngest ages, it's just

saying, Hey, here's, here's 20 bucks you

459

:

get for Christmas or for your birthday.

460

:

It's your money.

461

:

I always tell them you can

spend it on whatever you want.

462

:

Now, granted, if they're six

years old, I'm going to put a

463

:

lot of parameters around that.

464

:

Um, they don't know what to do.

465

:

They don't know how to think about money,

but I'm going to start that process and

466

:

say, look, you have five, you have 20.

467

:

It's really important that you always say

25 percent of this or say five spend 15.

468

:

And then we can talk about what.

469

:

What does it make sense

to spend that money on?

470

:

And you gotta let them make mistakes.

471

:

You have to let them blow through that

15 in an instant, and then they're

472

:

going to ask you for more money

because they want something else.

473

:

Now that's a lesson that you

can teach them right there.

474

:

It's like, well, you could have only

spent 5 and held back 10, and you

475

:

could have both of those things.

476

:

Or, you know, it starts to teach

them lessons about, like, if I

477

:

spend it on X, I can't get Y.

478

:

No, I'm not saying you do

that five or six years old.

479

:

I think that when they start, I mean, we

should talk about those types of things.

480

:

I mean, you can start

it as early as you want.

481

:

Um, but if we start talking about

those things in front of them, when

482

:

they're in their sort of tween years,

you know, 10 to 12, I think it's a

483

:

great time to start to have those

conversations, put money in their hands.

484

:

I think paying your kids for

chores that are not For the family.

485

:

This is my opinion.

486

:

Okay.

487

:

We have five kids, everybody

had, we had a chore grid.

488

:

Everybody had, you know,

their chores for the week.

489

:

And that was to help the household

because we're all in this together.

490

:

However, if I asked them to do something

that was beyond the household good And

491

:

it really was like taking of their time.

492

:

Why not compensate them for them?

493

:

You know, what's 20 or 10 to get them

to wash your car or just you know

494

:

to do something for me personally

Not the household what i've done

495

:

is i've taught them a lesson that

money just doesn't come from the

496

:

ether It comes from going to work.

497

:

Yeah, that's how it works, right

for most of us You got to go to

498

:

work to make money So I get mature.

499

:

I pay them for their job and

I say, Hey, it's your money.

500

:

However, let's talk about, you know,

how we should use those dollars, etc.

501

:

So I think that's really important.

502

:

You have to let them live it.

503

:

And then as they get further along,

before they get outside the house, and

504

:

they're kind of like, You know, at some

point, I think a lot of teenagers kind

505

:

of turn off from their parents, you know?

506

:

Yeah.

507

:

So I try to, I try to get to them

before them for that point where

508

:

they're not really listening to me.

509

:

And I just start to share bigger

concepts and that's a whole, you

510

:

know, that's a longer conversation

about the time value of money.

511

:

Like why investing early is so important.

512

:

Yeah.

513

:

And now that's a little more financial

advisor ask, I'll give you that.

514

:

I really think it's having and

fostering this conversation.

515

:

And tie in money scarcity.

516

:

You don't have complete dollars

and you got to work for it.

517

:

And then you can have those conversations

about college like your father had

518

:

with you We're not paying for this or

we can't pay for this or You have some

519

:

skin in the game because when it comes

to college and this is another rabbit

520

:

hole I think so many kids today don't

understand that college costs money.

521

:

I mean, they understand it costs money,

but they don't know what that means right

522

:

when you're 17 years old you don't know

what ten thousand dollars is compared to

523

:

50 compared to 100 It really they really

don't understand and get that and they're

524

:

not going to get that unless we really

step in and try and instill That for them,

525

:

Lesa Koski: you know, and as i'm

listening to you and I have a great

526

:

relationship with my parents Um, but

I think that you know how I said my

527

:

husband his dad worked in the mines You

know, he had he had a rougher childhood.

528

:

He didn't want his dad to pay for his

college He didn't want to take away

529

:

from his retirement It was a little

harder You For my parents to teach me

530

:

about money, because I think I felt,

and I never said this to him, but I

531

:

think I felt a little bit like, why

are you making this so hard for me?

532

:

You could afford to pay for this.

533

:

And I think Ed it's affected my parenting.

534

:

Because I'm a people pleaser.

535

:

I'm learning how not to be now

that I'm a grandma, but I think

536

:

that I, I mean, and I have great

kids and they're doing amazing too.

537

:

I, one's a physician, one's

a dad of two girls so far.

538

:

Um, and then my baby's in

college and, um, I don't know.

539

:

I just am feeling like I'm so

thankful right now as I listen

540

:

to you for those lessons.

541

:

And it's harder for somebody who's

maybe not going through a hard time

542

:

to teach their kids the value because

the kids might get mad at them.

543

:

You know what I mean?

544

:

They might be like, I

don't understand this.

545

:

We have enough money.

546

:

Why can't I do that?

547

:

And so I may have failed

my youngest a little bit.

548

:

Like, you know, she's the baby by

far and, um, she was adopted and I

549

:

think I lavished her too much and

she's in her second year of college.

550

:

And I just was thinking as I'm

talking to you, it's never too late.

551

:

I can just have this conversation with

her and, you know, start talking to her

552

:

about scarcity and about why I maybe

just let it go a little bit too far where

553

:

she maybe had more than she should have.

554

:

You know, to help her understand that.

555

:

And then she does like to

talk about investments.

556

:

She took a class and

was really into stocks.

557

:

And so maybe we do need

to get a little further.

558

:

I think you were going to say something.

559

:

Yeah.

560

:

Well, what happens depending upon

your childhood, your upbringing, or

561

:

your social economic condition, the,

in my case, growing up, I didn't

562

:

have to seek out these money stories.

563

:

They came to me.

564

:

I lived it.

565

:

So my kids, you know, they're, they're

much better off than I was growing up.

566

:

Thankfully.

567

:

Right.

568

:

That's what we're trying to do, but the

money lessons, they're not so evident.

569

:

They're not so obvious.

570

:

There's no strife.

571

:

There's no struggle,

certainly for the younger.

572

:

And if you have a multiple kids

or a number of years, right.

573

:

Socially or economically, you tend to

start low and then work your way up.

574

:

Right.

575

:

So where my oldest daughters, upbringing

and her financial experience, her

576

:

experience with money as, um, as sort of

told through the story of my life, right?

577

:

Like, cause my, my financial

situation flows down to them.

578

:

Her experience is very different

than the youngest, right?

579

:

Just like you were saying there, the

young, my youngest has had access to

580

:

more of everything than my oldest,

simply because I was further along

581

:

in my career and in my life and

in a better financial position.

582

:

My oldest.

583

:

learned lessons much more

easily around money because they

584

:

just showed up all the time.

585

:

I could say no.

586

:

I, because I had to say

no, I didn't make it up.

587

:

I'm like, no, we can't do this.

588

:

No, we can't do that.

589

:

We have to do all these different things.

590

:

Now with the youngest, I

didn't have to say no as much.

591

:

And so it's really important that we, as

parents understand that the environment

592

:

that we're creating for our kids is

not the same from one to the other.

593

:

And for your youngest.

594

:

Like you were just saying, you may

have to initiate these conversations,

595

:

then it's not too late to have those

conversations, even if they're adults.

596

:

Um, but for me, And for anyone in this

situation, you may have to initiate

597

:

those conversations more often versus

just stumbling upon a teachable moment.

598

:

Right.

599

:

So it requires us to be a little bit

more aware of what's happening in

600

:

that, that child's world and how is she

looking at the world through her eyes.

601

:

My case, they're all girls, so in her

eyes, but, uh, but that's, there's a,

602

:

there's a real amount of truth to that.

603

:

And so, um, but I really

think that there's no, there's

604

:

no, It's never too late.

605

:

It's never too late.

606

:

We work with a lot of women who are

in their fifties who have gotten

607

:

divorced or lost their husband, um,

from, from passing away and they're

608

:

starting over and they're just now

starting to try and figure this out.

609

:

And they're learning lessons at

50 and 60 that they never thought

610

:

they'd have to learn, but they're

certainly capable of learning them.

611

:

Lesa Koski: And it's a blessing.

612

:

The learning, you know, we go through

hard things and we learn and we grow

613

:

and it just makes life fuller, right?

614

:

Yeah, absolutely.

615

:

I mean, character, you know, all these

cliches about, you know, rough times,

616

:

difficult times builds character

and that's where growth comes.

617

:

But there's a lot of truth to that.

618

:

I firmly believe that.

619

:

Lesa Koski: Yep.

620

:

Yep.

621

:

Well, Ed, I went over time with you.

622

:

I rarely do that.

623

:

I really, really, from

the bottom of my heart.

624

:

I'm so thankful that you were here,

that I have these light bulb moments.

625

:

I hope I'm sure listeners did too.

626

:

And so I'm just grateful that

you've been here for doing divorce

627

:

different and saddle up live.

628

:

And I think I want to talk to you

again about that college daughter.

629

:

Maybe I need to do some coaching, uh, or

maybe I can have you back to talk about

630

:

kind of helping kids through finances,

because I think that is another issue

631

:

to add where they're kind of coming

back home and it is hard right now.

632

:

Um, they're coming back.

633

:

I have a lot of friends whose kids

are coming back home and living at

634

:

home, you know, because they can't

afford a house or whatever it is.

635

:

So maybe that's a subject for another day.

636

:

Sure.

637

:

Well, I appreciate you having me

on today and if it makes sense for

638

:

your audience and they like this

well enough, I'd be happy to come

639

:

back and impart some knowledge.

640

:

I do have a strong

affinity for that group.

641

:

My girls are right there.

642

:

They're at this stage right now.

643

:

I know what that world looks like.

644

:

I know what their friends are

talking about and there is, we

645

:

can probably end on this, but.

646

:

The reality is there is a lot.

647

:

I just had this conversation

with my daughter the other day.

648

:

She's like talking about her friends and

he's like, they want to know about money.

649

:

Do you want to learn more about it?

650

:

But they don't know where to go.

651

:

It's like their parents

aren't talking about it.

652

:

The Internet's a quagmire.

653

:

So they just they don't so they

don't do anything because they

654

:

don't really know where to turn.

655

:

And so there's a real opportunity.

656

:

And I firmly believe that generation.

657

:

This generation.

658

:

They're just coming into the workforce.

659

:

Now is the key.

660

:

So if we could get them trained up,

just the fundamentals, it doesn't have

661

:

to be enough to be on Wall Street.

662

:

Just get the fundamentals

right at this stage in life.

663

:

And that just you'll carry those

positive trends throughout your life.

664

:

And chances are you're going to share that

not with everyone or the women, at least

665

:

in your backyard and your extended family.

666

:

So I think there's a

real opportunity there.

667

:

Lesa Koski: I totally agree.

668

:

Ed, thank you so much for being here

and listeners, if you want to find Ed,

669

:

I'm going to have information in the

show notes, but where's, what's the best

670

:

thing to do if they want a little help?

671

:

I think if you're just starting

out or you're in the divorce space

672

:

and you're trying to figure that

out, I would go to enlightenher.

673

:

com.

674

:

There's some great resources

there, whether you're just getting

675

:

started on the financial side.

676

:

There's a piece about nine money myths.

677

:

It's a free white book, white paper.

678

:

You can get that.

679

:

Or we have 12 steps to safeguard your

financial and emotional well being.

680

:

If you're on the divorce side,

I think those are two great

681

:

free actionable resources.

682

:

One of the things that we believe

strongly in is not just about putting

683

:

information out into the world, but.

684

:

actionable information.

685

:

And my, my business partner who

happens to be a professional

686

:

woman, she's so adamant about that.

687

:

She says, look, I just don't

want to hear some great idea.

688

:

I want to know how to take

this and apply it in my life.

689

:

We need to build a guidebook

or something like that.

690

:

And that's what we've done.

691

:

Lesa Koski: I love it.

692

:

Okay.

693

:

Listeners go there, find that

it'll be in the show notes.

694

:

Thank you, Ed.

695

:

Thank you.

696

:

Appreciate it.

697

:

Lesa Koski: Take good care.

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About the Podcast

Saddle Up Live Podcast
Welcome to Saddle Up Live, a transformative podcast tailored for women aged 40 and beyond, where courage, God’ s grace, and a touch of sass are the driving forces behind conquering life's challenges. Join me, Lesa Koski, as I take you on a captivating ride through the multifaceted aspects of womanhood in this vibrant stage of life, covering everything from my journey through breast cancer, the intricacies of marriage and the joys of motherhood to the exciting adventures of grandparenting.

In each episode, we saddle up for candid conversations about God, health, relationships, family dynamics, and the beautiful chaos that comes along the way. But here's the twist: Saddle Up Live goes beyond navigating the highs and lows of life; it's a platform dedicated to sharing what we have learned along the way. I want to help women thrive through it all. Together, we'll uncover actionable strategies for personal and professional development, providing you with the tools and inspiration needed to blaze new trails and seize every opportunity that comes your way.

Moreover, we're committed to helping you suffer less and live more fully. Through our discussions on God, health, wellness, and mindfulness, we'll explore practical techniques for managing stress, cultivating resilience, and embracing a holistic approach to self-care.

So, whether you're looking for practical advice, heartfelt stories, or simply a supportive community of like-minded women, saddle up and join us on this exhilarating ride. Because at Saddle Up Live, we believe that every woman deserves to thrive, flourish, and live her best life - no matter her age or stage.


Bio: I am a wife, a mama, a grandma and an animal lover. I am blessed to be serving people from my barn office. I am obsessed with learning and communication. I love sharing what I learn with all of you! There is nothing more gratifying than holding people's hands through difficulties and sharing all the joy around us!
I am a recovering attorney who was mostly a stay at home mom; who adopted one and birthed two, ridden the bumpy marriage ride for 32 years. Found my passion at 50, learned how to control my mindset and anxiety and have built an amazing business in the last 6 years. I have journeyed through motherhood, weddings, grandbabies, entrepreneurship and menopause with grace, tears and laughter. I now I will share my story through breast cancer with you. I want to help women suffer less, know God loves them and they are worthy!! I am here to help you and I know all about what you’re going through.

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